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Liv: What are some good aspects of RPG franchises? What are some bad aspects?
Liv: Nah, I really don't have a desire to play VII...
Liv: I've played part of it and didn't enjoy it.
Jesus: Well, obviously a good thing is that they bring a sense of predictability.
Joel: VII is ok, but with all the mucking around they've done with it, it's hard to enjoy these days.
Jesus: The game gets better once you get out of Midgar.
Josh: I can't really come up with any really..."bad" aspects...
Michael: Eh, but predictability can backfire really easily.
Jesus: Michael - Exactly.
Jesus: At some point, you start running out of ideas.
Liv: Yeah.
Michael: Like we were just talking about, the trick is to know when to move on.
Josh: I mean, I suppose companies can limit themselves to certain gameplay aspects in order to ensure continuity, but stillc look at FFXII!
Jesus: What about FFXII?
Josh: Completely different style of gameplay, but it's still a single-player FF.
Josh: (in the main series, I mean)
Michael: True, but FF usually has minimal callback to other FFs.
Jesus: This is true.
Liv: Very true.
Jesus: Another bad thing about franchises is that you get fifty million imitators.
Liv: When you have franchises that just keep going on with the same characters game after game, it begins to get like an overdone sitcom.
Michael: Yeah. Gaming in general has a problem with "Me Too" syndrome.
Michael: How many WWII games are on the market now? Way too many.
Jesus: Save for a few dissenting games such as Baten Kaitos or Sudeki, RPGs are locked in the FF/DQ mold too much.
Jesus: Michael - I'm waiting for the WWIIFPRPG.
Jesus: You know it's coming.
Michael: And then the sea turns to blood and wormwood and
everybody dies. :P
* Liv likes WWII games... ^^;
Jesus: Liv - Well, you're obviously not alone.
Jesus: They keep makin' them.
Jesus: And generic fantasy RPGs are a lot like WWII FPSs.
Liv: I will agree with that.
Jesus: The settings are incredibly similar to the point of being indistinguishable, and the characters fall into stereotypes.
Michael: I don't think it's quite that bad. RPGs do have a problem with titles like Astonisha Story or Legend of Heroes, but we're getting better about it.
Jesus: It's like, since FFVII, every hero has spiky hair.
Liv: Ahahah, very true.
Jesus: Michael - Don't get me started on Legend of Heroes.
Jesus: Worst. Translation. Ever.
Josh: Despite the fact that there are a lot of imitators, sometimes working with what works isn't such a bad idea.
Jesus: How the second one hit the US at all is a wonder to me.
Jesus: Josh - I disagree.
Josh: You would. ^^
Jesus: If you can't do it first or do it better, don't do it.
Michael: Heh. I'm in the middle of LoH2. If it weren't for a review, the game'd be on fire even now.
Jesus: Michael - That sounds like a review on its own.
Josh: Jesus - Well, I didn't mean -completely- copying another game. I meant taking the basic idea and improving.
Michael: Heh.
Jesus: Josh - That's the thing.
Michael: Well, there's nothing wrong with incremental improvement, but the real problem comes when you don't do ANYTHING new.
Jesus: You really get a feeling some games are lifting elements completely
Jesus: Michael - Well, to be fair, it's hard not to do ANYTHING different.
Liv: Yeah...
Jesus: You have to do something different, if only to avoid copyright infringement suits.
Josh: Hey, 90% of all SaGa games are practically the same, yet I enjoy 'em.
Josh: Except for Unlimited Saga. I made that sit in the corner and
think about what it did.
* Liv chuckles.
* Jesus laughs.
Liv: I didn't enjoy that game either...
Michael: Unlimited Saga sounded interesting, but it got such horrible reviews that I never got around to it.
Jesus: But another bad thing about franchises, especially big
franchises, is that they overshadow smaller games.
* Josh really enjoyed SaGa Frontier II and Romancing Saga: Minstrel Song
Jesus: We were talking about this earlier, but FF is really the only recognizable RPG out there.
Jesus: At least to the mass market.
Michael: Yeah, which is a real problem, because some of the best and most innovative takes on the genre come from outside FF.
Jesus: I use it as an example, but if Enchanted Arms weren't a 360 game, it'd have been eaten alive by FFXII.
Jesus: Michael - Indeed.
Derek: Indeed, most innovation seems to be elsewhere.
Michael: Well, EA also has the benefit of being the only kid on the block.
Michael: Like LoH had when it first came out.
Jesus: EA only has that luxury in some sports.
Jesus: EA tried an FF-style RPG, and the reviews were mixed.
Michael: Er, EA as in Enchanted Arms, not Electronic Arts. ^^;
Jesus: Oh.
Liv: Ahaha, I was confused too.
Jesus: Michael - Well, Oblivion is out on the system, but yeah, Enchanted Arms is the only JRPG on the 360, at least until Blue Dragon and the rest come out.
Michael: It'll be interesting to see where 360 RPGs go, considering most Japanese customers have washed their hands of the system.
Josh: Well, Oblivion will be on -yet- another system by year's end.
Jesus: But that's saddening to me. For us to even really talk about other RPGs, they have to be on a system that doesn't get a lot of them.
Jesus: Michael - Well, I think if MS can consistently bring JRPGs to the platform, they can make a respectful market and establish a base for their next system.
Liv: A few more comments, and then I think we'll move on to the last subtopic. =)
Jesus: Of course, that's a big if.
Jesus: One more thing...
Michael: The real problem, then, is getting Japanese developers interested in the system.
Liv: Exactly.
Jesus: The potential exists that some franchises get exploited to market games that don't fit in the franchise.
Jesus: Michael - True.
Michael: I honestly can't see the 360 getting much of a market share without JRPGs, but without more market share, developers won't be interested. Bit of a Catch 22.
Michael: Er, market share in Japan, I mean.
Jesus: Michael ? Well, this is why MS is throwing money at Sakaguchi.
Michael: Heh. Very true.
Liv: Ok, last subtopic! Part of this one will meld into what we're already talking about.
Jesus: OK.
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